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The List:
Early indications of Steroid Use in Baseball (1988 to August 1998)
Section IV, pages 60-76
Ken Caminiti pages 71-73 (admitted steroid use)
Jose Canseco pages 61-66 (admitted steroid use)
Lenny Dykstra pages 66-67
Wally Joyner page 73 (admitted steroid use)
Androstenedione and Baseball\'s Broadening Awareness of the Use of Performance Enhancing Substances
Section V, pages 77-85
Mark McGwire pages 77-85
Derrick Turnbow page 130
Incidents Providing Evidence to Baseball Officials of Players\' Possession or Use of Performance Enhancing Substances
Section VI, pages 86-111
Manny Alexander pages 91-92
Ricky Bones pages 92-94
Alex Cabrera pages 94-95
Paxton Crawford pages 111
Juan Gonzalez pages 95-99
Jason Grimsley pages 106-108
Rafael Palmeiro pages 103-106
David Segui pages 110
Major League Baseball and the BALCO Investigation, Section VII, pages 112-137
Marvin Bernard pages 127-128
Barry Bonds pages 128-130
Bobby Estalella page 130
Jason Giambi pages 131-133
Jeremy Giambi pages 133-134
Armando Rios pages 113
Benito Santiago pages 134-135
Gary Sheffield pages 135-137
Randy Velarde pages 137
Information Obtained Regarding Other Players\' Possession or Use of Steroids and Human Growth Hormone
Section VIII, pages 138-233
Chad Allen pages 225-227
Mark Bell pages 219-220
Gary Bennett pages 222-223
Larry Bigbie pages 152-158
Kevin Brown pages 214-217
Mike Carreon pages 163-164
Jason Christiansen page 205
Howie Clark pages 228-229
Roger Clemens pages 167-175
Jack Cust page 159
Brendan Donnelly pages 224-225
Chris Donnells pages 190-194
Lenny Dykstra pages 149-150
Matt Franco page 165
Ryan Franklin page 190
Eric Gagne pages 217-219
Jason Grimsley pages 177-179
Jerry Hairston Jr. pages 207-208
Matt Herges pages 221-222
Phil Hiatt pages 194-195
Glenallen Hill pages 183-185
Todd Hundley pages 163-164
Mike Judd pages 230-232
David Justice pages 181-182
Chuck Knoblauch page 177
Tim Laker pages 159-161
Mike Lansing pages 196-197
Paul Lo Duca pages 208-211
Nook Logan page 229
Josias Manzanillo pages 161-163
Cody McKay pages 197-198
Kent Merker pages 198-199
Bart Miadich pages 212-213
Hal Morris pages 164-165
Daniel Naulty pages 232-233
Denny Neagle pages 187-188
Jim Parque pages 223-224
Andy Pettitte pages 175-176
Adam Piatt pages 199-201
Todd Pratt page 195
Stephen Randolph pages 206-207
Adam Riggs pages 211-212
Brian Roberts page 158
David Segui pages 150-152
F.P. Santangelo pages 182-183
Mike Stanton pages 205-206
Ricky Stone pages 230-232
Miguel Tejada pages 201-204
Mo Vaughn pages 186-187
Ron Villone pages 188-190
Fernando Vina pages 213-214
Rondell White pages 165-167
Jeff Williams pages 227-228
Todd Williams page 194
Kevin Young pages 195-196
Gregg Zaun pages 179-181
The Threat Posed by Internet Sales of Steroids and Human Growth Hormone
Section VIII, pages 234-257
Rick Ankiel pages 243-244
David Bell pages 244-245
Paul Byrd pages 245-246
Jose Canseco pages 246-247
Jay Gibbons pages 247-248
Troy Glaus pages 248-249
Jason Grimsley page 249
Jose Guillen pages 249-251
Jerry Hairston Jr. page 251
Darren Holmes pages 251-252
Gary Matthews Jr. pages 252-253
John Rocker page 254
Scott Schoeneweis pages 254-255
Ismael Valdez page 255
Matt Williams pages 255-256
Steve Woodward page 257 -
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way to produce a \'fake\' list before the actual one is published. is there some sort of confidentiality clause at your job?
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there is no way to correlate this list to the real one, it\'s just a bunch of stuff my friend will put together "in case". No different than pitchie putting up a list.
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:calls up jason varitek to see if he minds some bicyclist from CT bandying his name about:
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Damn, look at all those AL players. I\'m a little surprised to see Tori Hunter, David Ortiz and Pudge on there. Obviously it\'s not the actual list but I always figured Ortiz was just a fatass and only needed to get his weight behind the ball.
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I would be very disappointed if Ortiz or Varitek is on this list
I REALLY REALLY hope that ARod is on it though...that would be great
P.s sounds like you got a pretty sweet job there at ESPN...hiring??? -
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yea, I really think he pulled most of these out of thin air.
I\'d be shocked to see ortiz on the list. I\'m sure there have been some red sox players over the years, but Ortiz just doesn\'t seem built that way where he would use.
Less than how you feel about any given player though, I\'m curious what people think about how this will affect the sport in general, the teams, etc. -
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If anything I think it will take some heat off of Bonds. I always thought that he got too much blame for a problem that is obviously rampant across the league.
I would also be curious to know if Mitchell felt any pressure to overlook some Red Sox players because of his ties to the organization -
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i will laugh my ass off if pooholes is on there. :lol: I will be sad if Piazza is on there though
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I think that the more important thing is who used them when they were illegal.
If something is not illegal than *shocker* it\'s not a crime to do it.
MLB didn\'t have a "ban" until, what, 04? -
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Quote
I\'m a little surprised to see Pudge on there.
are you ser?
i bet there are like 50% of those names on the actual list. there are gonna be some big names listed i think. they said the list is between 60-80.
my question is...how did they actually compile the list. wsas it based on all the drug tests that people have taken over the years? and if so, when was a certain person tested? was it illegal then? Illegal or not, i dont care. i just want to know who was on what when i was young and rooting for these fuckos -
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Quote from: tyzack;172716
I think that the more important thing is who used them when they were illegal.
If something is not illegal than *shocker* it\'s not a crime to do it.
MLB didn\'t have a "ban" until, what, 04?
Steriods have been illegal in the US for a longtime. Just because MLB didn\'t have ban doesn\'t mean these guys didn\'t break the law.
It just really sucks that cheating in sports in general is so rampant. MLB, NFL whatever. It is always about the almighty dollar or ego or both.
I feel for all the guys and girls (i\'m looking at you Marion Jones) who do it clean only to loose jobs, scholarships, or have their medals taken away because of cheaters. What ever happened to sportsmanship ? Guys getting boarded and run by others in the NHL. There just seems to be so much classlessness in sports now. -
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I\'ve always been a huge baseball fan, but I disagree that all of these guys are a bunch of "fuckos". I\'d love for the game to still hold total integrity when it comes to substance, but it hasn\'t for a long time and to be honest, I don\'t hold it against them. If you spend your whole life completely dedicated to baseball, wanting to get better, wanting to be the best, and all of the sudden your natural talent can\'t sustain itself against the cream of the crop, and then someone offers a solution to that problem--it\'d be hard very, very hard not to bite the apple.
Bonds is in the situation he\'s in because he watched McGwire and Sosa take over the league when he knew he was a better baseball player. He levelled the playing field and showed it was true. And think about the mediocre ballplayers (relatively speaking in the MLB) who saw a light at the end of the tunnel flashing "Wanna\' Be An All-Star? Come Join...."
What I have a problem with is the poor character many have shown once they\'re in the dog-house. It\'s a sad situation, no doubt, and kids especially for the first time have a realistic, tarnished view of their heroes, but ultimately the athletes are fulfilling their life\'s desire which would be impossible naturally (given the competition), they\'re feeding the fans what they hope to be paying for--500 foot dongs, and in the end their reputations might suffer while their bodies certainly will.
It\'s a price they\'re obviously willing to pay because on their deathbed they won\'t drift away with images of the courtroom, they\'ll dream of those summer days where all seemed perfect as they trotted around third base hearing their name chanted by thousands and probably still think, "It was worth it for that piece of heaven I never would\'ve tasted."
I\'m not saying this is a desirable tale by any means, but I also don\'t know what it\'s like to be in a position where you\'re so close to reaching a potential you once thought impossible of achieving. I think the mind of a professional athlete is something to explore rather than just writing them off as a bunch of scumbags because they "cheated".
Now I ask myself, "Nick, if you could shoot yourself up with some magical **** that will make you rip a guitar like Tim Palmieri and sing like Rod Stewart, given you\'ll live a shorter life and may suffer physical anguish when the glory days are over, would you?"..... My answer: :chin:
Call me stupid, silly, maybe even cynical, whatever, but it\'s a dilemma that people seem to only want to scratch the surface on. -
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Interesting post, Gordo. I looked at this situation from a different perspective after reading.
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This post was stupid
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