thebreakfast.info
General Discussions => Spunk => Topic started by: Overexjoesure on June 01, 2007, 08:58:29 pm
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http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/mindbottling
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leith, do you mean "mindy sterling"?
Sorry Will Ferrell reference from Blades of Glory.
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http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/mindbottling
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leith, do you mean "mindy sterling"?
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Would it be possible for a jam band to make a more song written less jam focused album, but still play to their jam roots in concerts.
can a "jam band" make a more pop platinum selling radio friendly album, while still being a jam band live?
Isn\'t that what The Breakfast did with Duece, Real Radio, and Moxie Epoxy? Or tried to anyways.
Somewhat. Deuce was recorded live with a focus on stellar jamming. Listen to it again.
Real Radio was the victim of having no one to publicize it. In my opinion it was their best bet at getting noticed if they just had someone that could have pushed it. Stellar song selection, accessible lyrics, radio friendly cuts and some tight jams.
Moxie Epoxy? Not really sure what they tried to do there as I find it a mess of an album. Excellent songs throughout but no flow at all. Jumps from jam to jam w/ a couple of mindbottling songs. Not really focused on songs more than jams as you state.
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Would it be possible for a jam band to make a more song written less jam focused album, but still play to their jam roots in concerts.
can a "jam band" make a more pop platinum selling radio friendly album, while still being a jam band live?
Isn\'t that what The Breakfast did with Duece, Real Radio, and Moxie Epoxy? Or tried to anyways.
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Comparing the Breakfast to Porcupine Tree. HAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHA
Oh BDFree, you\'re the next Pryor....
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^^
Of course they can. But how many bands have actually bridged this gap... Phish yes, but creatively they were geniuses and they came about at just the right time, they were totally original.
Dave Matthews is successful in the studio but he\'ll "jam" out his songs to 10 or 20 minutes in concert sometimes.
Blues Traveler, same deal.
But really since Breakfast is now more prog-rocky we should look at the example of Porcupine Tree\'s latest album "Fear of a Blank Planet"
it\'s only 6 songs long and the average song length is probably about 10 minutes. You don\'t have to sell out to be popular.
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Would it be possible for a jam band to make a more song written less jam focused album, but still play to their jam roots in concerts. The difference between jam bands and most conventional radio friendly bands is how they make their money. Jam bands make most of their money touring playing live shows and don\'t make nearly as much selling records. Granted there is such a low percentage of jam bands that make millions. Phish is the perfect example, at their prime they were easily one of the top 5 gross touring bands in the country, behind the big teeny bopper pop acts and DMB. But they had 2 albums out of a dozen that went platinum. Plus their NYE Show at Big Cypress had 80,000 in attendance, all with no MTV and minimal radio-play. This is one jam band out of all that are out there ofcourse. But from an indusrty standpoint, can a "jam band" make a more pop platinum selling radio friendly album, while still being a jam band live? I have wondered why bands don\'t try to do this. I totally understand the whole, who cares about being a millionare when you can make enough money to live, while playing the music you love.
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bisco sucks
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Okay - I want to chime in with my two cents on the whole OMC thing. I\'ll first disclaim that I haven\'t been to a show in over 4 years, but am a fan of the music, so take what I say for what you will.
- I agree with OMC that this is and should be about money. Enjoying what you do is one thing, but once you have a family, having fun needs to take a backseat to supporting your family. I don\'t know the bands personal finances, but I\'m guessing that playing 2-3 bar shows a week won\'t pay the rent/mortgage for the three of them. This might also be the reason why Jordan left the band - just my opinion.
- I remember speaking with some people who shall remain nameless at the 2nd Uncle Sam Jam that the band really needed to start doing something or else they were going to end up like Max Creek, big in CT, but no where else. They seemed to have some lift after a few good festivals, but it seems like their balloon lost some air.
- Would you say that the band wants to be the next Grateful Dead or Phish, I would say why not. Those are the best two examples of jam bands that were successful. Do you think that they didn\'t have to do a little ass kissing or make song that fit the radio format? Of course they did those are the songs you hear, not the 1/2 ambient jam that follows a 5 minute Rock and Roll. I personally don\'t think that every song needs to be able to be jammed, I\'ve always had that gripe.
Okay, I\'ve got my reality comments out of the way. Do I want to see the band succeed, YES. Do I think that they can, YES. All three of them are talented musicians, but maybe they need to look at some of the constructive criticism that OMC provides and think long and hard on how they want to help themselves succeed.
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No worries here Leith. :)
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Leith I\'m not ignorant, I know the difference between generating enough cash to have an operation like moe. as opposed to the cash cow names he\'s throwing at us. Sure a band produces a record to make money. But that ISN\'T the sole reason. Oh, and I never said an artist has to be poor to make good art. I said as long as they make enough to support them and their family doing what they love. You completly missed my point.
Joe. When have I ever accused you of being ignorant? I just think your wording was confused then.
I get what you mean and in that sense The Breakfast are a perfect example.
They make a living doing what they want and playing when they want. There is no incentive for them to actually work towards anything bigger when they are comfortable with the life they have now.
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Would it not be possible to re-package the music of the more cutting edge jam artists, tailoring to the appeals of a larger audience? Strip 75% of the running time and re-work into a marketable product. I\'m sure it is possible for a few, particularly those flirting with the frontier of electronic innovation. Mainstream people do not understand the jams and on occasion, I find myself short of the patience to sit through 15 minutes of content for 3 minutes of musical bliss (contingent on the song/artist).
Not worth the cost. Not to mention, who would you sell it to since you would loose your core audience. I like the way you are thinking though. More of that needs to happen in your community.
Bands can be comfortable without sucking the teet of the music industry. Jambands like Umphrey\'s, moe. and Bisco are perfect examples. Are they millionaires? Probably not. Do they more or less have full creative control of their output, and make a living off of doing what they love the most. YES! Is that all that should matter??? YES!!
Trey, "you" are flat wrong. Without the music industry, there would be no jamband scene. Have you ever thought about who distributes the music you listen to you? Or who owns the venues that you see music in? All of these companies are apart of the industry in one form or another.
"Jambands like Umphrey\'s, moe. and Bisco are perfect examples. Are they millionaires? Probably not."
Not even close!!!! How many times have you heard their music on a TV show or in a movie? More then likely zero. So their Music Publishing is not making them what it could. Mainstream consumers want short hip songs that sell. These bands DO NOT make that type of music; hence they will never have the mainstream appeal or the bank account to match it.
There are a lot of major label bands that I work with everyday that have artistic control. Just look at Kelly Clarkson, she wrote her new album and had control over it. The Old Man could not even stop her. Even though he slammed her on Idol.
Bottom line is that Jambands are not mainstream bands. They are a sub-culture that has little to no impact on my bottom lines. Be a fan and enjoy the music. Just do not look for the success that you want them to have.
yeah, you still don\'t get it. Sure it\'s a give and take between the industry and growing bands. But my point is MONEY should not be the driving force in playing music for a living. As far as I\'m concerned those jambands who don\'t chart on your fabricated radar of bullshit are success stories because live music is their career. Plain and simple. They have great management and booking.
YOU want to sell records. YOU look at them as buzzwords to throw around at your overpriced, psuedo Spago luncheons. I look at them as artists. They want to play live music for a living and release an album because it\'s THEIR creation, not YOURS.
Also, Umphrey\'s song "Uncle Wally" was featured as background music on Alias. Do your research.
That is all. That is all. That is all.
Money should not be the driving force? You would get laughed out of a board meeting with that line. How am I going to justify to my shareholders that we are not looking to make a profit?
"fabricated radar of bullshit" - Thats a good one. Just enjoy the music Trey and STOP pretending you know how how to run a label or build a band.
Just for the record. Spago is not for lunch, it\'s for dinner. For lunch it\'s The Grill, but that\'s only during the week. Would you like to chime in with any other assumptions?
"it\'s THEIR creation, not YOURS" - The label owns the masters when they sign. If the band is smart they kept their publishing and hired an agent to shop their songs.
Also, Umphrey\'s song "Uncle Wally" was featured as background music on Alias. Do your research.
You are about the only person who knows that was the band. It DID NOTHING for their sales. Would you like to see the Soundscan reports?
Want to play hardball, Why are they not a VCast Band yet?
Not even close!!!! How many times have you heard their music on a TV show or in a movie? More then likely zero.
Using that logic, I\'d have to say "Psychedelic Breakfast" "made" it then.
And while most of your points have been good and insightful, I just don\'t see how "making it" as anything to do with making millions of dollars. Not all people are money hungry ****, ya know. My definition of seeing this band "make it" has nothing to do with them making millions of dollars with their music; but more or less being allowed to make a comfortable income, enough to live on, based on doing what they love to do; whether or not they feel the same is irrelevant because you continually say that ALL of us fans in this "community" want them to "make it" as in being multi-millionaires, and that couldn\'t be further from the truth.
Really though, I am a graphic artist by trade, I love to do it (sometimes), does that mean I need to be the next Michaelangelo of the digital world and make millions of dollars to have "made it" in that industry? I\'d have to say **** no. As long as I am making a fair enough wage that allows me to comfortably support me and my family (hypothetically since I am not married with kids and don\'t have a family yet), and I am happy doing what I am doing, and I have a happy family who supports my career, I\'d have to consider myself as "making it".
Some people are driven. Others are not! Why limit yourself?
Leith I\'m not ignorant, I know the difference between generating enough cash to have an operation like moe. as opposed to the cash cow names he\'s throwing at us. Sure a band produces a record to make money. But that ISN\'T the sole reason. Oh, and I never said an artist has to be poor to make good art. I said as long as they make enough to support them and their family doing what they love. You completly missed my point.
Ok, you need to go to school and start taking notes.
Sure a band produces a record to make money.
Trey, you do not produce a record to make money. Albums are used as promotional tools by the labels. Bands make their money on merchandising and touring. Not on record sales. The band has to pay the label back for the cost of making the album + expenses.
Ice Cube is the difference in this sense. He funded his latest album on his own and hired The Firm to market it and EMI to distribute it. Cube made about $6 per album. He did good, but he was able to do it since he had the CAPITAL to fund it and the relationships to do it on his own.
P.S., his live show is great. He sings verses of NWA songs through out the whole night to complete the songs.
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Leith I\'m not ignorant, I know the difference between generating enough cash to have an operation like moe. as opposed to the cash cow names he\'s throwing at us. Sure a band produces a record to make money. But that ISN\'T the sole reason. Oh, and I never said an artist has to be poor to make good art. I said as long as they make enough to support them and their family doing what they love. You completly missed my point.
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yeah, you still don\'t get it. Sure it\'s a give and take between the industry and growing bands. But my point is MONEY should not be the driving force in playing music for a living.
YOU want to sell records. YOU look at them as buzzwords to throw around at your overpriced, psuedo Spago luncheons. I look at them as artists. They want to play live music for a living and release an album because it\'s THEIR creation, not YOURS.
Also, Umphrey\'s song "Uncle Wally" was featured as background music on Alias. Do your research.
That is all. That is all. That is all.
You don\'t get it Joe.
Money HAS to be the driving force in playing music for a living. We use money in this country and most others to buy things to live like shelter and food. So what an artist has to be poor to be relevant and make good art? Bullshit.
You either play the game and make a living at it or you get a day job and play music for music\'s sake not making a living at it. Pretty simple.
Oh and name me a band that would put itself in debt to make an album as their creation and not sell it. Come on really?
As for UM on Alias the only place it was even mentioned was the Bort you know a message board among millions of message boards on the net. Lots of buzz was created with that huh?
pffft.
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Not even close!!!! How many times have you heard their music on a TV show or in a movie? More then likely zero.
Using that logic, I\'d have to say "Psychedelic Breakfast" "made" it then.
And while most of your points have been good and insightful, I just don\'t see how "making it" as anything to do with making millions of dollars. Not all people are money hungry ****, ya know. My definition of seeing this band "make it" has nothing to do with them making millions of dollars with their music; but more or less being allowed to make a comfortable income, enough to live on, based on doing what they love to do; whether or not they feel the same is irrelevant because you continually say that ALL of us fans in this "community" want them to "make it" as in being multi-millionaires, and that couldn\'t be further from the truth.
Really though, I am a graphic artist by trade, I love to do it (sometimes), does that mean I need to be the next Michaelangelo of the digital world and make millions of dollars to have "made it" in that industry? I\'d have to say **** no. As long as I am making a fair enough wage that allows me to comfortably support me and my family (hypothetically since I am not married with kids and don\'t have a family yet), and I am happy doing what I am doing, and I have a happy family who supports my career, I\'d have to consider myself as "making it".
Amen.
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Not even close!!!! How many times have you heard their music on a TV show or in a movie? More then likely zero.
Using that logic, I\'d have to say "Psychedelic Breakfast" "made" it then.
And while most of your points have been good and insightful, I just don\'t see how "making it" as anything to do with making millions of dollars. Not all people are money hungry ****, ya know. My definition of seeing this band "make it" has nothing to do with them making millions of dollars with their music; but more or less being allowed to make a comfortable income, enough to live on, based on doing what they love to do; whether or not they feel the same is irrelevant because you continually say that ALL of us fans in this "community" want them to "make it" as in being multi-millionaires, and that couldn\'t be further from the truth.
Really though, I am a graphic artist by trade, I love to do it (sometimes), does that mean I need to be the next Michaelangelo of the digital world and make millions of dollars to have "made it" in that industry? I\'d have to say **** no. As long as I am making a fair enough wage that allows me to comfortably support me and my family (hypothetically since I am not married with kids and don\'t have a family yet), and I am happy doing what I am doing, and I have a happy family who supports my career, I\'d have to consider myself as "making it".
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Bands can be comfortable without sucking the teet of the music industry. Jambands like Umphrey\'s, moe. and Bisco are perfect examples. Are they millionaires? Probably not. Do they more or less have full creative control of their output, and make a living off of doing what they love the most. YES! Is that all that should matter??? YES!!
Trey, "you" are flat wrong. Without the music industry, there would be no jamband scene. Have you ever thought about who distributes the music you listen to you? Or who owns the venues that you see music in? All of these companies are apart of the industry in one form or another.
"Jambands like Umphrey\'s, moe. and Bisco are perfect examples. Are they millionaires? Probably not."
Not even close!!!! How many times have you heard their music on a TV show or in a movie? More then likely zero. So their Music Publishing is not making them what it could. Mainstream consumers want short hip songs that sell. These bands DO NOT make that type of music; hence they will never have the mainstream appeal or the bank account to match it.
There are a lot of major label bands that I work with everyday that have artistic control. Just look at Kelly Clarkson, she wrote her new album and had control over it. The Old Man could not even stop her. Even though he slammed her on Idol.
Bottom line is that Jambands are not mainstream bands. They are a sub-culture that has little to no impact on my bottom lines. Be a fan and enjoy the music. Just do not look for the success that you want them to have.
yeah, you still don\'t get it. Sure it\'s a give and take between the industry and growing bands. But my point is MONEY should not be the driving force in playing music for a living. As far as I\'m concerned those jambands who don\'t chart on your fabricated radar of bullshit are success stories because live music is their career. Plain and simple. They have great management and booking.
YOU want to sell records. YOU look at them as buzzwords to throw around at your overpriced, psuedo Spago luncheons. I look at them as artists. They want to play live music for a living and release an album because it\'s THEIR creation, not YOURS.
Also, Umphrey\'s song "Uncle Wally" was featured as background music on Alias. Do your research.
That is all. That is all. That is all.
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Behind every great band is a great team and manager. The bands who make it, run their organizations like corporations.
As a finance geek, I share your sentiments. A diet reduced in drum circles and higher in Wall St. Journal protein will better the serve the jam community managers and strategists.
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I found it interesting to discover that John Mayer told this sound guy that he considered his early music to be "sell-out material" which was aimed at pleasing those guys. (You know, them.) He said that his last album was the only one which he recorded for himself, as true artistic expression.
not for nuthin but I really like his most recent album and his trio live album.
John Mayer did what he had to do and now he is putting out the music he wants with the support of Aware/Columbia.
that\'s what I always say when people are surprised that I listen to his latest.
His last album was really good if you have not listened to it yet.
:that:
With Rick Rubin running Columbia now with his American team, it will be interesting to see if he produces John\'s next album. That would be a work of art.
:that: :thumbsup: Rick Rubin is the man, his efforts on johnny\'s (cash) last albums were amazing.
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Would it not be possible to re-package the music of the more cutting edge jam artists, tailoring to the appeals of a larger audience? Strip 75% of the running time and re-work into a marketable product. I\'m sure it is possible for a few, particularly those flirting with the frontier of electronic innovation. Mainstream people do not understand the jams and on occasion, I find myself short of the patience to sit through 15 minutes of content for 3 minutes of musical bliss (contingent on the song/artist).
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Sure, he makes many valid points, many of which I can agree with wholeheartedly. But the Umphreys comments "Can\'t sell out The Key Club in L.A." and "They have ZERO buzz...." sort of irk me. L.A., hmmm, believe it has a large Metal scene. Remember all those great (LOL) metal bands of the \'80\'s and \'90\'s with big hair, makeup and ridiculous clothing? A bunch of talentless ass kissing wannabe rock stars who did whatever the record companies wanted them to do. They sold their souls to be poplular. Is this what musicians should strive to be like? And on the "Zero buzz......without good to great vocals you will not sell and appeal to a large audience. No audience, no sales." Yeah, get a singer and we\'ll make these guys popular and ride them all the way to the bank. I guess that instrumental bands don\'t count at all. Spoken like a true money grubbing capitalist with a penchant for becoming a future record company executive. I do believe that Umphreys is playing main stages at mostly all of the festivals they are playing this summer. "Zero buzz...." hmmm.
And the John Mayer comments. This is totally against what music is supposed to be. I strongly believe that music is a form of art and should be treated as such. It\'s mentalities such as this, as much as they help, have also helped to ruin the music industry. Money, Money, Money. Yes, it does make the world go around, but at what cost? I feel that if a band can continue to make music, do it their way and make a living off of it, more power to them. I believe it\'s called integrity. No, it doesn\'t work for most bands, but personally I have more respect for a band that tried to do it their way and failed than allow the corporate world to strip the music of its soul and artistry for the sole purpose of capitalism.
As the senior member of .info (at least I think I am), these are tenets which I strongly believe in and have shaped my musical tastes and listening habits for the last 35 years. Two words, creativity and talent is what determines what I enjoy to listen to. Thanks to Joe for keeping this one alive. Comments?
Why would my comment "sort of irk" you? Yes the metal scene has been large in LA since the 80\'s. But what is wrong with that? The Crue through some of the best parties back in the day just north of The Strip. They did what they had to do to make with the help of Doc. Without his help or guidance they would not have made it to where they are today.
Google Doc McGee and just read about the impact he had on the band. Behind every great band is a great team and manager. The bands who make it, run their organizations like corporations.
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"They sold their souls to be popular."
That is just a myth among the thousands who have never made it. They did what it took to make it. Bottom line.
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"I guess that instrumental bands don\'t count at all."
Nope, they do not sell enough records to justify the cost and time spent marketing and promoting their records. However, there are some great instrumental records that I enjoy.
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"I do believe that Umphreys is playing main stages at mostly all of the festivals they are playing this summer. "Zero buzz...." hmmm."
Has Umphreys headlined a Live Nation or AEG Festival this summer? Nope! There name never came up once in the conversations for putting together certain "major" festivals this summer. Buzz bands got on the bill, because they had buzz..... The festivals they are playing are low on the totem pole.
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John Mayer did what he had to do and now he is putting out the music he wants with the support of Aware/Columbia. His last album was really good if you have not listened to it yet. Not to mention he puts on a great live show.
With Rick Rubin running Columbia now with his American team, it will be interesting to see if he produces John\'s next album. That would be a work of art.
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Two words, creativity and talent is what determines what I enjoy to listen to.
Enjoy the music and let us run the business.
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There are a lot of major label bands that I work with everyday that have artistic control. Just look at Kelly Clarkson, she wrote her new album and had control over it. The Old Man could not even stop her. Even though he slammed her on Idol.
Alternate theory (just to cover all the known possibilities):
OMC = Marcial Mendez -> Taylor Hicks -> Simon Fuller
Hmm, so maybe my theory wasn\'t a longshot? Maybe insert another name in the 3rd link?
Where\'s the IT forensics team??
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Bands can be comfortable without sucking the teet of the music industry. Jambands like Umphrey\'s, moe. and Bisco are perfect examples. Are they millionaires? Probably not. Do they more or less have full creative control of their output, and make a living off of doing what they love the most. YES! Is that all that should matter??? YES!!
Trey, "you" are flat wrong. Without the music industry, there would be no jamband scene. Have you ever thought about who distributes the music you listen to you? Or who owns the venues that you see music in? All of these companies are apart of the industry in one form or another.
"Jambands like Umphrey\'s, moe. and Bisco are perfect examples. Are they millionaires? Probably not."
Not even close!!!! How many times have you heard their music on a TV show or in a movie? More then likely zero. So their Music Publishing is not making them what it could. Mainstream consumers want short hip songs that sell. These bands DO NOT make that type of music; hence they will never have the mainstream appeal or the bank account to match it.
There are a lot of major label bands that I work with everyday that have artistic control. Just look at Kelly Clarkson, she wrote her new album and had control over it. The Old Man could not even stop her. Even though he slammed her on Idol.
Bottom line is that Jambands are not mainstream bands. They are a sub-culture that has little to no impact on my bottom lines. Be a fan and enjoy the music. Just do not look for the success that you want them to have.
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OMC = The Man
but not like "The Man" like the man that takes your ganja away. "The Man", in a good way.
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Seeing as for some strange reason I don\'t know have poll posting privellages, here is the mind bending question we\'ve been asking ourselves this past week.
Who is OMC?
A.Grayson Brulte aka TiedyeToga
B. Friend of Grayson Brulte
C. Friend of Steffmo
D. Friend of Josh Kroop
E. Bring Back Kote
F. I don\'t care, this poll isn\'t even a poll. I feel like I\'m taking the SAT\'s. Joe get a **** life.
HA..........I would be reluctant to guess A. B is a possibility. I am pretty sure that C and D are out. I would rather hear Za get band support and make it into the rotation before they bring back Kote..........
It doesnt sound like OMC is full of **** or pulling our legs, though i wonder who the person was from this community that contacted him was.... Regardless, I just hope Spunk or timn8r can truy to get to the bottom of this and debunk any rumors and whathaveyous.
Nice poll Joe.....
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OMC = Katie Reilly
:wah::wah::wah:
:lol:rotfl:lol:
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I chose E. Bring Back Kote!
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What I want to know is are you really rolling on the floor laughing out loud right now?
I really, really hope you are.
I completed a double roll!!
A.Grayson Brulte aka TiedyeToga
B. Friend of Grayson Brulte
Hahahahaha!! I have pondered both of these scenarios since his first loooong post.
A.) Def. not Grayson, there were no hawhawhawhaws. ;)
B.) I don\'t think Grayson cares enough about this band anymore to give a rats ass.
I think it\'s Joe\'s buddy. Come on...he has stated in the past about all of his so called "contacts" and "friends" in the industry. Although...all of those "contacts" have never netted any gain. He\'s just toying with us with this "poll". :lol:
I already asked Joe the same question offline.
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A.Grayson Brulte aka TiedyeToga
B. Friend of Grayson Brulte
Hahahahaha!! I have pondered both of these scenarios since his first loooong post.
A.) Def. not Grayson, there were no hawhawhawhaws. ;)
B.) I don\'t think Grayson cares enough about this band anymore to give a rats ass.
I think it\'s Joe\'s buddy. Come on...he has stated in the past about all of his so called "contacts" and "friends" in the industry. Although...all of those "contacts" have never netted any gain. He\'s just toying with us with this "poll". :lol:
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What I want to know is are you really rolling on the floor laughing out loud right now?
I really, really hope you are.
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sheeeeet, i\'d write a song called \'mmmm mmmmm budweiser\' and put it on my debut album \'live from a mcdonald\'s in a wal-mart while wearing nike\'s\' if it meant playing guitar and never worrying about bills again!
rotfl
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OMC = Katie Reilly
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All these replies and not one answer... sssssiiggghhhhhh
Alternate theory (just to cover all the known possibilities):
OMC = Marcial Mendez -> Taylor Hicks -> Simon Fuller
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sheeeeet, i\'d write a song called \'mmmm mmmmm budweiser\' and put it on my debut album \'live from a mcdonald\'s in a wal-mart while wearing nike\'s\' if it meant playing guitar and never worrying about bills again!
of course, john mayer is still way too pussified for me (and his cover of wait until tomorrow sounded waaaay too white, although it did contain one of the album\'s best solo moments) and people are giving him tons of praise for attaining the same status as kenny wayne sheppard ten years ago, but if that\'s what it takes to live the dream, i can\'t argue. hell, if jason mraz can make a great living at it, john mayer deserves far better, i suppose!
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Regarding John Mayer: I find it interesting that no one bothers to take his perspective into account. Did it ever occur to anyone that perhaps he IS making the music that he wants to make? Whether we like it or not?
A friend of mine played in a fusion band, one of whose members inherited ****-****-loads of money. They recorded an album in the same studio, with one of the same "sound guys" (can\'t remember his exact position) that John Mayer has used. I found it interesting to discover that John Mayer told this sound guy that he considered his early music to be "sell-out material" which was aimed at pleasing those guys. (You know, them.) He said that his last album was the only one which he recorded for himself, as true artistic expression.
Just a little f.y.i.
Bands can be comfortable without sucking the teet of the music industry. Jambands like Umphrey\'s, moe. and Bisco are perfect examples. Are they millionaires? Probably not. Do they more or less have full creative control of their output, and make a living off of doing what they love the most. YES! Is that all that should matter??? YES!!
Oh. And whether you like these bands or not... WHAT HE SAID.
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Bands can be comfortable without sucking the teet of the music industry. Jambands like Umphrey\'s, moe. and Bisco are perfect examples. Are they millionaires? Probably not. Do they more or less have full creative control of their output, and make a living off of doing what they love the most. YES! Is that all that should matter??? YES!!
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Leith, yes, I would make a terrible manager. But isn\'t the jam scene a market unto itself? Does every band want to become part of the "mainstream market?" And if so, how much of their integrity do they have to give up to do it? I just have a problem with bands "selling out" to become popular. I remember hearing John Mayer about 5 years ago and loved his stuff. I don\'t care for solo stuff, but I find his trio work is much more in tune with my tastes. Yes, my post comes totally from a fans perspective and no, I\'m not a fan of mainstream music, as I find most of it stale and uninteresting. Thanks for responding. :)
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All these replies and not one answer... sssssiiggghhhhhh
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Sure, he makes many valid points, many of which I can agree with wholeheartedly. But the Umphreys comments "Can\'t sell out The Key Club in L.A." and "They have ZERO buzz...." sort of irk me. L.A., hmmm, believe it has a large Metal scene. Remember all those great (LOL) metal bands of the \'80\'s and \'90\'s with big hair, makeup and ridiculous clothing? A bunch of talentless ass kissing wannabe rock stars who did whatever the record companies wanted them to do. They sold their souls to be poplular. Is this what musicians should strive to be like? And on the "Zero buzz......without good to great vocals you will not sell and appeal to a large audience. No audience, no sales." Yeah, get a singer and we\'ll make these guys popular and ride them all the way to the bank. I guess that instrumental bands don\'t count at all. Spoken like a true money grubbing capitalist with a penchant for becoming a future record company executive. I do believe that Umphreys is playing main stages at mostly all of the festivals they are playing this summer. "Zero buzz...." hmmm.
And the John Mayer comments. This is totally against what music is supposed to be. I strongly believe that music is a form of art and should be treated as such. It\'s mentalities such as this, as much as they help, have also helped to ruin the music industry. Money, Money, Money. Yes, it does make the world go around, but at what cost? I feel that if a band can continue to make music, do it their way and make a living off of it, more power to them. I believe it\'s called integrity. No, it doesn\'t work for most bands, but personally I have more respect for a band that tried to do it their way and failed than allow the corporate world to strip the music of its soul and artistry for the sole purpose of capitalism.
As the senior member of .info (at least I think I am), these are tenets which I strongly believe in and have shaped my musical tastes and listening habits for the last 35 years. Two words, creativity and talent is what determines what I enjoy to listen to. Thanks to Joe for keeping this one alive. Comments?
You don\'t seem to understand the point about UM. The fests you mention they are playing the main stages on? Big Whoop. In the larger scale of the music industry UM and the jam scene in general have little to zero buzz.
Just because UM is a fairly major player in the jam scene does not equate to buzz in the mainstream market to which OMC is referring to.
Yeah OMC is speaking from the point of a "capitalist with a penchant for becoming a future record company executive." If a band wants to make money as a touring band these are things they should consider. If they are happy with being a local band that makes trips to "play out" or are more interested in making music for art\'s sake and don\'t want to make a living at playing music then they ignore these things.
I agree music is a form of art where you seem to be mistaken is confusing music made for art\'s sake and making music as your primary source of income.
So yeah what John Mayer did to some may not be what music is about but from another angle if Mayer had not played to the music execs he would never have been able to play with the people he has or make the kind of music he wants on his terms now.
As for the tenets to which you believe in? Awesome for you but you would make a horrible Manager ;)
Peace
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Save OMC, Save the World
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at least you can get molly and doses in the umphreys lot
:shrug:
edit: huh?
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Sure, he makes many valid points, many of which I can agree with wholeheartedly. But the Umphreys comments "Can\'t sell out The Key Club in L.A." and "They have ZERO buzz...." sort of irk me. L.A., hmmm, believe it has a large Metal scene. Remember all those great (LOL) metal bands of the \'80\'s and \'90\'s with big hair, makeup and ridiculous clothing? A bunch of talentless ass kissing wannabe rock stars who did whatever the record companies wanted them to do. They sold their souls to be poplular. Is this what musicians should strive to be like? And on the "Zero buzz......without good to great vocals you will not sell and appeal to a large audience. No audience, no sales." Yeah, get a singer and we\'ll make these guys popular and ride them all the way to the bank. I guess that instrumental bands don\'t count at all. Spoken like a true money grubbing capitalist with a penchant for becoming a future record company executive. I do believe that Umphreys is playing main stages at mostly all of the festivals they are playing this summer. "Zero buzz...." hmmm.
And the John Mayer comments. This is totally against what music is supposed to be. I strongly believe that music is a form of art and should be treated as such. It\'s mentalities such as this, as much as they help, have also helped to ruin the music industry. Money, Money, Money. Yes, it does make the world go around, but at what cost? I feel that if a band can continue to make music, do it their way and make a living off of it, more power to them. I believe it\'s called integrity. No, it doesn\'t work for most bands, but personally I have more respect for a band that tried to do it their way and failed than allow the corporate world to strip the music of its soul and artistry for the sole purpose of capitalism.
As the senior member of .info (at least I think I am), these are tenets which I strongly believe in and have shaped my musical tastes and listening habits for the last 35 years. Two words, creativity and talent is what determines what I enjoy to listen to. Thanks to Joe for keeping this one alive. Comments?
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bisco sucks
Wilco sucks. You\'re contending for fag-of-the-year honors with taste like that.:wave:
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Who cares? He/She makes great points that no one can really argue with.
Obviously Joe.
And while we\'re at it, I\'m super curious myself (though that is my nature).
Obviously Leith?
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Who cares? He/She makes great points that no one can really argue with.
<< begs to differ. ( :lol: damn that stubborn I\'talian streak...)
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Who cares? He/She makes great points that no one can really argue with.
Obviously Joe cares.
And while we\'re at it, I\'m super curious myself (though that is my nature).
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^^^ Another excellent point.
My last name is Hawe, not Howe, just so you know.
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bisco sucks
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Who cares? He/She makes great points that no one can really argue with.
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Fer sure Sister Howe.
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Could we do it as analogies?
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Seeing as for some strange reason I don\'t know have poll posting privellages, here is the mind bending question we\'ve been asking ourselves this past week.
Who is OMC?
A.Grayson Brulte aka TiedyeToga
B. Friend of Grayson Brulte
C. Friend of Steffmo
D. Friend of Josh Kroop
E. Bring Back Kote
F. I don\'t care, this poll isn\'t even a poll. I feel like I\'m taking the SAT\'s. Joe get a **** life.