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Quote from: Spacey;142465
the kid was a legal US citizen since 1992.
Legal citizen or resident? People do not not usually receive citizenship upon arrival.
Either way, this is an absolute tragedy.
I just wish our freedoms didn\'t have to be up for debate so often; the constitution was a well-crafted document that was based on hundreds of years of historical learnings; there\'s nothing whimsical about it. -
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In fact, there are towns/cities in the U.S. that mandate that all non-criminal adults own weapons. .[/QUOTE]
:no: Can you please provide a list of these towns/cities, so that I can make a note to myself to never move there. -
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your right, Al.
He was a legal U.S. resident. -
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Quote from: Stephengencs;142358
The worst thing about this is that now, all of a sudden, nobody cares about Don Imus being fired for calling a bunch of nappy headed ho\'s, nappy headed ho\'s.....His whole show for like 30 years has been about calling a spade a spade, and now, all of a sudden, he\'s fired for some bullshit.....**** Al Sharpton and Jessie Jackson, and all the media watchdogs. **** them up their stupid asses....Why dont those two morons focus on lifting up people instead of bringing down people?
amen.
and this VaTech incident will be all over the news until the next \'big\' thing happens, whether it be a week or a month. mass media makes me laugh. I don\'t know, maybe I\'m wrong for what I\'m about to say, but **** it. The people out there saying this could have been prevented should be shot themselves (not literally, I\'m not a violent person). You cannot prevent something like this. It happens. Bad? yes. Disgusting? sure. Preventable? absolutely **** not. All people are crazy. Every single one of us. You may not believe that you are, but trust me, it\'s there, in the back of your mind somewhere, waiting to be let out. Luckily, for most people, it stays put. But there is no way in hell anyone, anywhere, can predict these types of actions from someone, whether or not his creative writing was \'disturbing\', or because they listen to death music. That\'s how people express themselves, and by trying to label them as a \'problem\' people are just adding to the person\'s internal crazy clock, whether just starting it or making it move full speed. Not that that makes sense in anyone else\'s head, but it does in mine. Anyway, back to preventing these things with laws and the like. I say **** THAT. Let it be. I\'m an **** for saying it but I\'d much rather see events like this once every 8-10 years, than an event like 9/11 once every 50. Do the math, it\'d take 100 more of these incidents to equal what happened in one day on 9/11. So basically, **** trying to focus on preventing these incidents, and prevent the bigger, deadlier ones.
[/RANT] -
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Quote from: antbach;142502Quote from: Stephengencs;142358
The worst thing about this is that now, all of a sudden, nobody cares about Don Imus being fired for calling a bunch of nappy headed ho\'s, nappy headed ho\'s.....His whole show for like 30 years has been about calling a spade a spade, and now, all of a sudden, he\'s fired for some bullshit.....**** Al Sharpton and Jessie Jackson, and all the media watchdogs. **** them up their stupid asses....Why dont those two morons focus on lifting up people instead of bringing down people?
amen.
and this VaTech incident will be all over the news until the next \'big\' thing happens, whether it be a week or a month. mass media makes me laugh. I don\'t know, maybe I\'m wrong for what I\'m about to say, but **** it. The people out there saying this could have been prevented should be shot themselves (not literally, I\'m not a violent person). You cannot prevent something like this. It happens. Bad? yes. Disgusting? sure. Preventable? absolutely **** not. All people are crazy. Every single one of us. You may not believe that you are, but trust me, it\'s there, in the back of your mind somewhere, waiting to be let out. Luckily, for most people, it stays put. But there is no way in hell anyone, anywhere, can predict these types of actions from someone, whether or not his creative writing was \'disturbing\', or because they listen to death music. That\'s how people express themselves, and by trying to label them as a \'problem\' people are just adding to the person\'s internal crazy clock, whether just starting it or making it move full speed. Not that that makes sense in anyone else\'s head, but it does in mine. Anyway, back to preventing these things with laws and the like. I say **** THAT. Let it be. I\'m an **** for saying it but I\'d much rather see events like this once every 8-10 years, than an event like 9/11 once every 50. Do the math, it\'d take 100 more of these incidents to equal what happened in one day on 9/11. So basically, **** trying to focus on preventing these incidents, and prevent the bigger, deadlier ones.
[/RANT]
^original papa^ -
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Quote from: Yoda;142477
Can you please provide a list of these towns/cities, so that I can make a note to myself to never move there .
Here\'s one I found, though I know there are others like it in more conservative states.Quote from: FreeRepublic.com;142514
GUN OWNERSHIP MANDATORY IN KENNESAW, GEORGIA (Crime Rate Plummets)
GUN OWNERSHIP MANDATORY IN KENNESAW, GEORGIA
Crime Rate Plummets - Why Doesn\'t The Media Visit Kennesaw?
"The New American magazine reminds us that March 25th marked the 16th anniversary of Kennesaw, Georgia\'s ordinance requiring heads of households (with certain exceptions) to keep at least one firearm in their homes. The city\'s population grew from around 5,000 in 1980 to 13,000 by 1996 (latest available estimate). Yet there have been only three murders: two with knives (1984 and 1987) and one with a firearm (1997). After the law went into effect in 1982, crime against persons plummeted 74 percent compared to 1981, and fell another 45 percent in 1983 compared to 1982. And it has stayed impressively low. In addition to nearly non-existent homicide (murders have averaged a mere 0.19 per year), the annual number of armed robberies, residential burglaries, commercial burglaries, and **** have averaged, respectively, 1.69, 31.63, 19.75, and 2.00 through 1998. With all the attention that has been heaped upon the lawful possession of firearms lately, you would think that a city that requires gun ownership would be the center of a media feeding frenzy. It isn\'t. The fact is I can\'t remember a major media outlet even mentioning Kennesaw. Can you? The reason is obvious. Kennesaw proves that the presence of firearms actually improves safety and security. This is not the message that the media want us to hear. They want us to believe that guns are evil and are the cause of violence. The facts tell a different story. What is even more interesting about Kennesaw is that the city\'s crime rate decreased with the simple knowledge that the entire community was armed. The bad guys didn\'t force the residents to prove it. Just knowing that residents were armed prompted them to move on to easier targets. Most criminals don\'t have a death wish. There have been two occasions in my own family when the presence of a handgun averted potential disaster. In both instances the gun was never aimed at a person and no shot was fired." -
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just wow.
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Quote from: Spacey;142534
just wow.
If you think you\'re saying "just wow" now, get a load of this...
These are two plays written by the shooter and submitted to class. Unbelievable. If you\'re the really emotional type or are easily upset or frequently have nightmares, etc., do not read these. I\'m serious.
http://newsbloggers.aol.com/2007/04/17/cho-seung-huis-plays/
Check out the note from the kid who posted them too.
This whole thing obviously sucks and reminds me how lucky I am to make it through the day. I have seriously contemplated getting into firearm ownership all day. Never thought I\'d say that. -
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Quote from: Wolfman;142541
I have seriously contemplated getting into firearm ownership all day. Never thought I\'d say that.
:thumbsup:
I\'ve had Firearms training "camp" on my \'to do\' list for the last year. -
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Quote from: davepeck;142225
don\'t worry, this time tomorrow the whole investigation will begin on how this could happen, how the police failed to act in a reasonable amount of time and then, after all that is done, the media will speculate on the shooters\' movies/gaming/music preference.
underneath all of that, the victims won\'t even be mentioned.
sad, really.
sad, but true.
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Quote from: Wolfman;142541
These are two plays written by the shooter and submitted to class. Unbelievable. If you\'re the really emotional type or are easily upset or frequently have nightmares, etc., do not read these. I\'m serious.
http://newsbloggers.aol.com/2007/04/17/cho-seung-huis-plays/
those two plays are just awful! i dont find them disturbing because he uses too many poor references and adjectives to describe the themes in his plays. he also uses up a page and a half for guns n roses lyrics to mr. brownstone. how was this kid an english major in his senior year? his grammer is just as bad as his stories. i would have failed him years ago. -
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I still would like to see proof that those were his and not someone making it up for publicity.
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wow!
I have never read worse plays. the grammar is awful (especially being an english major), and the story-lines are ridiculous. i wonder how much of the content from them is a true reflection of his life? both plays have a common factor...sexual assault...hmmm... -
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Quote
Va. Tech gunman accused of stalking
By ADAM GELLER, AP National Writer
2 minutes ago
BLACKSBURG, Va. - The gunman involved in the deadliest shooting in modern U.S. history had previously been accused of stalking two female students and had been taken to a mental health facility in 2005 after he parents worried he might be suicidal, police said Wednesday.
Cho Seung-Hui\'s actions had worried one woman enough with his calls and e-mail in 2005 that police were called in, said Police Chief Wendell Flinchum
He said the woman declined to press charges and Cho was referred to the university disciplinary system. In one of the incidents ? both in late 2005 ? the department received a call from Cho\'s parents who were concerned that he might be suicidal and he was taken to mental health facility, he said.
Flinchum said he knew of no other police incidents involving Cho until the deadly shootings Monday at a girl\'s dorm room and then a classroom building across campus. The gunman killed 32 people before fatally shooting himself.
Police searched Cho\'s door room on Tuesday and recovered, among other items, a chain and combination lock, according to documents filed Wednesday; the front doors of Norris Hall had been chained shut from the inside during the shooting rampage.
Other items seized include a folding knife; two computers, a hard disk and other computer disks; documents, books, notebooks and other writings; a digital camera; CDs; and two Dremel tools.
Cho\'s roommates and professors on Wednesday described a troubled, very quiet young man who rarely spoke to his roommates or made eye contact with them. His bizarre behavior became even less predictable in recent weeks, roommates Joseph Aust and Karan Grewal said.
Grewal said he had pulled an all-nighter on homework before the shootings and saw Cho at around 5 a.m.
"He didn\'t look me in the eye. Same old thing. I left him alone," He told CNN. He said when he saw Cho that morning and during the weekend, Cho didn\'t smile, didn\'t frown and didn\'t show any signs of anger. Grewal also said he never saw any weapons.
Several students and professors described Cho as a sullen loner. Authorities said he left a rambling note raging against women and rich kids. News reports said that Cho, a 23-year-old senior majoring in English, may have been taking medication for depression and that he was becoming increasingly erratic.
Professors and classmates were alarmed by his class writings ? pages filled with twisted, violence-drenched writing.
"It was not bad poetry. It was intimidating," poet Nikki Giovanni, one of his professors, told CNN Wednesday.
"I know we\'re talking about a youngster, but troubled youngsters get drunk and jump off buildings," she said. "There was something mean about this boy. It was the meanness ? I\'ve taught troubled youngsters and crazy people ? it was the meanness that bothered me. It was a really mean streak."
Giovanni said her students were so unnerved by Cho\'s behavior, including taking pictures of them with his cell phone, that some stopped coming to class and she had security check on her room. She eventually had him taken out of her class, saying she would quit if he wasn\'t removed.
Lucinda Roy, a co-director of creative writing at Virginia Tech, said she tutored Cho after that.
"He was so distant and so lonely," she told ABC\'s "Good Morning America" Wednesday. "It was almost like talking to a hole, as though he wasn\'t there most of the time. He wore sunglasses and his hat very low so it was hard to see his face."
Roy also described using a code word with her assistant to call police if she ever felt threatened by Cho, but she said she never used it.
Cho\'s writing was so disturbing, though, he was referred to the university\'s counseling service, said Carolyn Rude, chairwoman of the university\'s English department.
In screenplays Cho wrote for a class last fall, characters throw hammers and attack with chainsaws, said a student who attended Virginia Tech last fall. In another, Cho concocted a tale of students who fantasize about stalking and killing a teacher who sexually molested them.
"When we read Cho\'s plays, it was like something out of a nightmare," former classmate Ian MacFarlane, now an AOL employee, wrote in a blog posted on an AOL Web site.
"The plays had really twisted, macabre violence that used weapons I wouldn\'t have even thought of."
He said he and other students "were talking to each other with serious worry about whether he could be a school shooter."
"We always joked we were just waiting for him to do something, waiting to hear about something he did," said another classmate, Stephanie Derry. "But when I got the call it was Cho who had done this, I started crying, bawling."
Despite the many warning signs that came to light in the bloody aftermath, police and university officials offered no clues as to exactly what set Cho off.
Cho ? who arrived in the United States as boy from South Korea in 1992 and was raised in suburban Washington, D.C., where his parents worked at a dry cleaners ? left a note that was found after the bloodbath.
A law enforcement official described it Tuesday as a typed, eight-page rant against rich kids and religion. The official spoke on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to speak to the media.
"You caused me to do this," the official quoted the note as saying.
Cho indicated in his letter that the end was near and that there was a deed to be done, the official said. He also expressed disappointment in his own religion, and made several references to Christianity, the official said.
The official said the letter was either found in Cho\'s dorm room or in his backpack. The backpack was found in the hallway of the classroom building where the shootings happened, and contained several rounds of ammunition, the official said.
With classes canceled for the rest of the week, many students left town.
Tuesday night, thousands of Virginia Tech students, faculty and area residents poured into the center of campus to grieve together. Volunteers passed out thousands of candles in paper cups, donated from around the country. Then, as the flames flickered, speakers urged them to find solace in one another.
As silence spread across the grassy bowl of the drill field, a pair of trumpets began to play taps. A few in the crowd began to sing Amazing Grace.
Afterward, students, some weeping, others holding each other for support, gathered around makeshift memorials, filling banners and plywood boards with messages belying their pain.
"I think this is something that will take a while. It still hasn\'t hit a lot of people yet," said Amber McGee, a freshman from Wytheville, Va.
Monday\'s rampage consisted of two attacks, more than two hours apart ? first at a dormitory, where two people were killed, then inside a classroom building, where 31 people, including Cho, died. Two handguns ? a 9 mm and a .22-caliber ? were found in the classroom building.
According to court papers, police found a "bomb threat" note ? directed at engineering school buildings ? near the victims in the classroom building. In the past three weeks, Virginia Tech was hit with two other bomb threats. Investigators have not connected those earlier threats to Cho.
Cho graduated from Westfield High School in Chantilly, Va., in 2003. His family lived in an off-white, two-story townhouse in Centreville, Va.
At least one of those killed in the rampage, Reema Samaha, graduated from Westfield High in 2006. But there was no immediate word from authorities on whether Cho knew the young woman and singled her out.
"He was very quiet, always by himself," neighbor Abdul Shash said. Shash said Cho spent a lot of his free time playing basketball and would not respond if someone greeted him.
Some classmates said that on the first day of a British literature class last year, the 30 or so students went around and introduced themselves. When it was Cho\'s turn, he didn\'t speak.
On the sign-in sheet where everyone else had written their names, Cho had written a question mark. "Is your name, `Question mark?\'" classmate Julie Poole recalled the professor asking. The young man offered little response.
Cho spent much of that class sitting in the back of the room, wearing a hat and seldom participating. In a small department, Cho distinguished himself for being anonymous. "He didn\'t reach out to anyone. He never talked," Poole said.
"We just really knew him as the question mark kid," Poole said.
One law enforcement official said Cho\'s backpack contained a receipt for a March purchase of a Glock 9 mm pistol. Cho held a green card, meaning he was a legal, permanent resident. That meant he was eligible to buy a handgun unless he had been convicted of a felony.
Roanoke Firearms owner John Markell said his shop sold the Glock and a box of practice ammo to Cho 36 days ago for $571.
"He was a nice, clean-cut college kid. We won\'t sell a gun if we have any idea at all that a purchase is suspicious," Markell said.
Investigators stopped short of saying Cho carried out both attacks. But State Police ballistics tests showed one gun was used in both.
And two law enforcement officials, speaking on condition of anonymity because the information had not been announced, said Cho\'s fingerprints were on both guns. Their serial numbers had been filed off.
Gov. Tim Kaine said he will appoint a panel at the university\'s request to review authorities\' handling of the disaster. Parents and students bitterly complained that the university should have locked down the campus immediately after the first burst of gunfire and did not do enough to warn people.
Kaine warned against making snap judgments and said he had "nothing but loathing" for those who take the tragedy and "make it their political hobby horse to ride."
"I\'m satisfied that the university did everything they felt they needed to do with the heat on the table," Kaine told CBS\' "The Early Show" on Wednesday. "Nobody has this in the playbook, there\'s no manual on this."
___
Associated Press writers Stephen Manning in Centreville, Va.; Matt Barakat in Richmond, Va.; Lara Jakes Jordan and Beverley Lumpkin in Washington; and Vicki Smith, Sue Lindsey, Matt Apuzzo and Justin Pope in Blacksburg contributed to this report.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070418/ap_on_re_us/virginia_tech_shooting -
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read that earlier. it seems like 2005 they knew this cat was unstable.
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