Author Topic: All 3 NYPD Officers Aqcuitted of All Charges in Sean Bell Murder (Read 2402 times)

Yoda · « **on:** April 25, 2008, 11:08:34 am »

:thumbsdow :slap: :rolleyes: :doh: :sigh: :banghead:

SkyePrizm · « **Reply #1 on:** April 25, 2008, 12:11:44 pm »

i\'m not defending the cops. but this is what i have to say...

their job = not easy. the level of stress the officers were going through when they made that split second decision to shoot at Sean Bell and his friends....probably was terrifying.

everyday police officers in cities (even cities like hamden and new haven and east haven i.e. the malik jones case) face enormous stress. stress unfathomable to some of us.

Especially undercover police officers. Often they are NOT wearing bullet proof vests. They are in clothes, looking like you or i. Their lives are usually in jeopardy....are always in the line of fire. If they feared for their lives, they must have had a good or valid reason. I won\'t bore you with all the stories i\'ve heard. But I can tell you, its a job i can\'t imagine doing.

Yoda · « **Reply #2 on:** April 25, 2008, 12:22:03 pm »

I understand and appreciate what they go through; my brother-in-law is a federal agent and he deals with the scum of the earth in Newark and the surrounding area.

I don\'t think that Sean Bell and his crew were innocent either, but I do think that Oliver\'s 31 shots were excessive. He had to go through a complete clip then take the clip out, reload and start firing again. That\'s all I\'m saying.

solver · « **Reply #3 on:** April 25, 2008, 12:45:15 pm »

it\'s hard to fight the headlines like "unarmed groom shot 50 times by undercover police on the night before his wedding"

i had to wiki/google this case after i saw it on the news, and from what i read i can agree with bloomberg that there is no good verdict for this trial.

31 shots, and yeah reloading the clip, and yeah mismanaged crime scene, and yeah etc..

i don\'t like/trust the police a whole helluvalot, but i respect the kind of trauma they go through on the daily. i also have a level of repect for the justice system which would lead me to believe that this case was not taken lightly. i can also repect that there is a link between criminal records and "personal character" records and that people with a conviction of selling crack/**** might be prone to be in the wrong places at the wrong times.

usually when someone dies like this, the blame has to go somewhere, but i don\'t think it\'s up to the headlines/media to place it.

\'sall i\'m sayin\'

FrankZappa · « **Reply #4 on:** April 25, 2008, 12:56:20 pm »

Quote from: Yoda;187371

:thumbsdow :slap: :rolleyes: :doh: :sigh: :banghead:

:that:

wildcoyote · « **Reply #5 on:** April 25, 2008, 01:19:42 pm »

Quote from: solver;187387

it hard to fight the headlines like "unarmed groom shot 50 times by undercover police on the night before his wedding"

i can also repect that there is a link between criminal records and "personal character" records and that people with a conviction of selling crack/**** might be prone to be in the wrong places at the wrong times.

Crack dealers=rough cats.
These are not your hippy dippy pot/pill dealers.
Most people who worship that gang banger culture in music and movies would **** themselves if they ever ran into the genuine article.
The cops knew what they were dealing with and took no chances.

SkyePrizm · « **Reply #6 on:** April 25, 2008, 02:41:14 pm »

Quote from: wildcoyote;187392

Quote from: solver;187387
it hard to fight the headlines like "unarmed groom shot 50 times by undercover police on the night before his wedding"

i can also repect that there is a link between criminal records and "personal character" records and that people with a conviction of selling crack/**** might be prone to be in the wrong places at the wrong times.

Crack dealers=rough cats.
These are not your hippy dippy pot/pill dealers.
Most people who worship that gang banger culture in music and movies would **** themselves if they ever ran into the genuine article.
The cops knew what they were dealing with and took no chances.

Exactly.

Most undercover narcotic officers really don\'t care about the nickle/dime pot dealers. Hippies are harmless in their eyes.

its the crack and heroine dealers that they want. Cause they are vicious.....violent criminals would be an understatement.

skalnbyc · « **Reply #7 on:** April 25, 2008, 02:51:47 pm »

They heard the punks thuggin\' it up in the sleazy club mention a gun outside after some confrontational behavior.

Though I did not read enough details of the encounter once the car was stopped, I can imagine there was some movement that sparked the gunfire. I don\'t blame them for shooting so many times, assuming there are illegal guns in the car, they are shooting to kill. Besides, look at Bell\'s face, he looks like a punk.

Yoda · « **Reply #8 on:** April 25, 2008, 03:11:12 pm »

The "said" gun was never found. Go figure!

tyzack · « **Reply #9 on:** April 25, 2008, 03:31:04 pm »

This stuff happens all the time. I am sure that if you ask the cop he feels helluva bad about it. Probably that is punishment enough - knowledge that you iced an unarmned man.

kindm's · « **Reply #10 on:** April 25, 2008, 03:44:03 pm »

They were not crack dealers.

They were never "stopped"

What the police claim happened was that "someone" in his group said something about a gun. In the Bar. They followed these guys outside. Now this is where things are up in the air.

The 3 guys were already in the car. The police claim they announced who they were, already with weapons drawn, they claim it was at this point that Bell tried to hit an officer with his car.

The guys in the car (that survived) claims the officers never announced who they were and that they feared they were going to be robbed etc.

Before these guys left they had words with one of the witnesses. That guy testified that HE said something about a gun and not anyone in Bells party. So according to testimony no one in Bells party nor bell himself said anything about a gun.

So it all boils down to whether or not you believe that the police announced who they were prior to what happened. I personally believe they did not. being that they were undercover at the strip club trying to bust drugs and hookers leads me to think it was in their interest to keep their cover.

They shot 3 unarmed men in a car who\'s 1 crime that night would have been DUI. Bell was shot 4 times, 1 guy took 4 shots and lived, the other took 14 (yes 14 bullets) and survived.

that whole undercovers don\'t care about this and that is utter nonsense. Cops will bust you plain and simple. If they can get a collar they will take the collar. Hippies maybe harmless but they are also an easy bust. Which is why we still see all the pot busts we do.

if the people being police officers can not handle the stress they shouldn\'t be police officers. The fact that can kill a citizen simply by saying "they talked about a gun" or "I was afraid" should scare anyone. there is no oversight, when was the last time an unarmed civilian was shot and the police were called to task ?

Cops lie and make **** up all the time. the only problem is that they rarely get caught doing it. because other cops keep quiet or help construct the lie and the judges always take the word of a cop over anyone.

Yoda · « **Reply #11 on:** April 25, 2008, 03:45:57 pm »

I\'m sure it does happen all the time. Does it make it right, no. If you shot an unarmed person in self defense because you thought he had a gun, but he didn\'t; don\'t you think that you\'d be in jail right now.

kindm's · « **Reply #12 on:** April 25, 2008, 03:50:51 pm »

Quote from: Yoda;187420

I\'m sure it does happen all the time. Does it make it right, no. If you shot an unarmed person in self defense because you thought he had a gun, but he didn\'t; don\'t you think that you\'d be in jail right now.

Well that depends. If you say you feared for your life then a lot of times you can walk. Now the civil suit is entirely different matter.

And to the person that said they had a criminal record blah blah blah. I have a criminal record does that mean that it is ok for the police to kill me simply for being at a strip club at 4AM ? Because if that is the case then ****, I guess I am lucky to still be alive. And how does having been arrested and convicted of a crime automatically discount anything ? With 1-4 Americans in jail at the moment, that would make it almost impossible to find witnesses who have never been involved with the law. So the precedent has been set that if you have ever been arrested and convicted of a crime you are automatically less than credible. think on that for a moment.

SkyePrizm · « **Reply #13 on:** April 25, 2008, 07:47:26 pm »

Quote from: kindm\'s;187419

that whole undercovers don\'t care about this and that is utter nonsense. Cops will bust you plain and simple. If they can get a collar they will take the collar. Hippies maybe harmless but they are also an easy bust. Which is why we still see all the pot busts we do

Cops lie and make **** up all the time. the only problem is that they rarely get caught doing it. because other cops keep quiet or help construct the lie and the judges always take the word of a cop over anyone.

if you ever see me at a show, come over and talk to the guy that is sometimes with me. He\'ll show you his badge, debate, and make convo with you...be ever so pleasant and be nice to you. Might even buy you a shot. And thats where my opinion on that whole "who cares about busting hippies" comes from. Cause thats his opinion. He has bigger fish to fry. He doesn\'t care you are all high and smoking at shows. You are harmless. You aren\'t hurting anyone. So why would he hurt you all? He likes good music just like anyone else. Maybe its a rare opinion. But i know it does exist for some, including him.

Oh, and that last statement, all cops don\'t lie. You can say almost anything bad about any profession. However, its much easier to pick on the cops, right? Attorneys all lie. Doctors are all scam artists. Priests are all abusers. I\'ll could go all night...

They are only human. They have one of the most thankless jobs. Everyone is always ready to attack....and those same people are the ones that will quickly dial 911 when in trouble....

kindm's · « **Reply #14 on:** April 25, 2008, 08:50:35 pm »

Quote from: SkyePrizm;187438

Quote from: kindm\'s;187419
that whole undercovers don\'t care about this and that is utter nonsense. Cops will bust you plain and simple. If they can get a collar they will take the collar. Hippies maybe harmless but they are also an easy bust. Which is why we still see all the pot busts we do

Cops lie and make **** up all the time. the only problem is that they rarely get caught doing it. because other cops keep quiet or help construct the lie and the judges always take the word of a cop over anyone.

if you ever see me at a show, come over and talk to the guy that is sometimes with me. He\'ll show you his badge, debate, and make convo with you...be ever so pleasant and be nice to you. Might even buy you a shot. And thats where my opinion on that whole "who cares about busting hippies" comes from. Cause thats his opinion. He has bigger fish to fry. He doesn\'t care you are all high and smoking at shows. You are harmless. You aren\'t hurting anyone. So why would he hurt you all? He likes good music just like anyone else. Maybe its a rare opinion. But i know it does exist for some, including him.

Oh, and that last statement, all cops don\'t lie. You can say almost anything bad about any profession. However, its much easier to pick on the cops, right? Attorneys all lie. Doctors are all scam artists. Priests are all abusers. I\'ll could go all night...

They are only human. They have one of the most thankless jobs. Everyone is always ready to attack....and those same people are the ones that will quickly dial 911 when in trouble....

Sorry but I guess we can agree to disagree. I come from a law enforcement family. Sure there maybe great cops, but from my experience they are the exception. And until they start turning in their brothers who pull all the bullshit they are just as guilty.

He might not care but trust me I bet he could rattle off names in a HEARTBEAT guys he directly works with who would.

And in my personal experience they are generally cool 1 on 1 but when the other cops show up it is a completely different experience.